AirBnB Quebec government to Regulate(Maybe)

[Lisa in Ottawa]

Well, on the news today the Quebec Provincial government is debating imposing taxes on airbnb owners similar to hotel taxes. This after strenuous lobbying from hotel association. Personally I think that's too draconian. But I think the rental agencies who pretend they're individual owners need to be weeded out somehow.
They are fairly easy to spot. Same picture for many different listing. Almost identical wording...

I guess governments/ municiplities are scrambling to keep up with the changing times.
I'm amazed how many people use Airbnb. People I never thought would take a risk, who don't travel much, all ages. think it's easy for them to go to 1 source and they may think they're gettinga taste of a local ma and pa venture but that isn't necessarily the case. Obviously filling a niche.

The owner of the apartment we stayed in in Rome(who has stellar reviews on ST) advertises in Airbnb, Vrbo and Homeaway.

Now Uber I don't get.. Why would you get into a totally unregulated vehcle with a driver you don't know and no real recourse if something happens. Regulated cabbies have training, identification, spend $ on their vehcles, you can see their number posted, are usually metered etc.

No one has adequately explained to me the draw of Uber. To save time? To save $. Too funny when one of the first things your we've read and been told that when arriving at airport in a country such as Mexico is make sure the cab is legit and metered. Now everything goes.
Thoughts? That's my rant!

 

[Pauline]

I don't get Uber either. I also don't get doing everything on your phone - sit in a good chair and use your computer, darnit! (I feel so old.)

Airbnb seems to have changed the vacation rental market so that it appeals to a group of people who didn't use vacation rentals before. Homeaway had that market locked up, after they acquired all the big rent-from-owner sites (like VRBO), but somehow Airbnb came in and took it over. I think the appeal of Airbnb is:
- good website, good searching
- easy feedback from guests
- the traveler books and pays through AirBnB, so doesn't get into this whole email back and forth with the owner and then having to do a money transfer

Am I correct on this? I have looked at Airbnb places, but have never booked through them. I am still loyal to local agencies and Homeaway.

Another change that I have seen in the last 10 years, first with Homeaway and now with Airbnb, is the number of apartments in cities. In the "old" days it was not easy to find apartments in smaller towns - only in the most well known cities like Paris, London, Rome. Homeaway and Airbnb have made it easy for the person who owns one apartment (maybe it is their vacation home) rent it out.

I was emailing someone recently who has vacation rentals in Umbria and they said the market is very slow and has been for a few years. This is someone with a well established reputation and a beautiful place. I am shocked by this. When I was doing a lot of traveling in Tuscany and Umbria, 10 years ago, you had to book six months ahead to get the good places.

So what is happening? Do we have a glut of vacation rentals because of Airbnb? Are people only wanting to stay in towns and cities, and not in the countryside? I used to like staying in the countryside, but in the last few years have wanted to stay in towns - all of our trips in the last few years have been based in towns. I think I am going back to the idea of staying in the countryside more.

 

[Pauline]

Santa Fe (my old hometown) started regulating vacation rentals 10 years ago. They have a limit of 1000 rentals allowed. You have to apply and pay for a license. I am happy about this because there are already too many second homes in Santa Fe. This limits them somewhat - people can't rent them out for income.

 

[Lisa in Ottawa]

I forgot to mention something I learned about Airbnb. Ottawa is hosting Women's World Soccer cup and everyone( or those registered with Airbnb) received an email asking if they wanted to become hosts. They are uber pro active. I thought about it and then nah not for me. It made the news here.

The few places I have rented through their site have been very successful. The young woman in Bellagio has been great as well. Responsive to all emails. She has lots of reviews posted and many are very specific. I believe the apartment is in her parent's building. I think she grew up there and now works in Milan. She also rents her apartment there. You really couldn't get more small time. so that feels good.

Country vs city. Well, I think most people prefer to stay in cities and now they have more options. Especially Europeans with all the low cost flights.
Mmm I wonder if demographics come into play. Younger people prefer cities. Many of us who are now considered the older generation are fairly well traveled and maybe not travelling as much or wanting to be near more amenities. Who knows. I also prefer country or smaller towns. But for a longer stay or off season, I want a busier location.

 

[Roz]

I don't get Uber either. I also don't get doing everything on your phone - sit in a good chair and use your computer, darnit! (I feel so old.)

Pauline, you are a woman after my own heart. I couldn't agree with you more. I don't feel particularly old in that regard, just that I don't see good reasons to do many things the way most of the kids do.

Some time ago I started a discussion on Slow Trav here, about my concerns regarding Airbnb (which I have never used). I still feel that way -- I don't want to use a site that requires so much personal information from me. But then I don't really use social media, for much the same reason. I am somewhat of a privacy freak, I guess, but there are so many horror stories about identity theft that I try to do what I can to prevent that problem.

Napa, by the way, allows only a very few vacation rentals. Some years ago they did allow it, and 40-some people started renting their homes. When they changed the law, they grandfathered those people, but nobody else can legally rent their home for less than, I think, 3 months. I think there are special problems here, where so many of the activities center around wine, and a lot of young people were renting for a weekend in quiet residential neighborhoods and having noisy drunken parties.

 

[Roz]

the Quebec Provincial government is debating imposing taxes on airbnb owners similar to hotel taxes

Lisa, is this something different from saying that people who stay in Airbnb accommodations should pay the same room tax as hotel guests? San Francisco has imposed that requirement, and I guess Airbnb has agreed to pay the tax directly to the city. I presume the tax is then passed along to the renter in some form.

But there is a huge campaign in San Francisco to outlaw Airbnb altogether. See here.

I guess one problem is that such laws are very difficult and time-consuming to enforce. The city did pass a regulatory law a few months ago, but are already admitting that they can't really enforce it, as explained in this article.

 

[Lisa in Ottawa]

Pauline, you are a woman after my own heart. I couldn't agree with you more. I don't feel particularly old in that regard, just that I don't see good reasons to do many things the way most of the kids do.

Some time ago I started a discussion on Slow Trav here, about my concerns regarding Airbnb (which I have never used). I still feel that way -- I don't want to use a site that requires so much personal information from me. But then I don't really use social media, for much the same reason. I am somewhat of a privacy freak, I guess, but there are so many horror stories about identity theft that I try to do what I can to prevent that problem.

Napa, by the way, allows only a very few vacation rentals. Some years ago they did allow it, and 40-some people started renting their homes. When they changed the law, they grandfathered those people, but nobody else can legally rent their home for less than, I think, 3 months. I think there are special problems here, where so many of the activities center around wine, and a lot of young people were renting for a weekend in quiet residential neighborhoods and having noisy drunken parties.

Roz,
I'm no defender of Airbnb but have used them and been very happy. I'm not on social media either. I don't see what you mean about them collecting all kinds of info. I have not given them any more info about myself than I have to any other rental site. I think PP requires more. Every site uses cookies so they know your location etc. I've certainly never given my passport number. I would not use them if that was required!

 

[Lisa in Ottawa]

Lisa, is this something different from saying that people who stay in Airbnb accommodations should pay the same room tax as hotel guests? San Francisco has imposed that requirement, and I guess Airbnb has agreed to pay the tax directly to the city. I presume the tax is then passed along to the renter in some form.

But there is a huge campaign in San Francisco to outlaw Airbnb altogether. See here.

I guess one problem is that such laws are very difficult and time-consuming to enforce. The city did pass a regulatory law a few months ago, but are already admitting that they can't really enforce it, as explained in this article.

i'm not sure exactly what it means. It's too bad b/c it's good to have alternatives. And for some people it's a way to meet others and pay the bills etc. I think it's just gotten out of hand.
Uber and Airbnb have become so large and unwieldy and of course, thier owners are uber rich with very deep pockets. We'll see where everything is after the dust settles. I think once started very difficult to control.
I wonder what next?

 

[Lisa in Ottawa]

Santa Fe (my old hometown) started regulating vacation rentals 10 years ago. They have a limit of 1000 rentals allowed. You have to apply and pay for a license. I am happy about this because there are already too many second homes in Santa Fe. This limits them somewhat - people can't rent them out for income.

Pauline if you look up Santa Fe on airbnb site, there are tons of places to rent. I'm not so sure it's regulated like you indicate. I didn't even look at private rooms but independent apartments/ casitas. Tons. looking at the pictures of some of the hosts I can't quite see them "applying" for a license. Ooops I see you say 1000 rentals allowed. i thought you gave a much lower figure. Well, 1000 is uite a bit for a small town. Except for hotels I bet airbnb has cornered the market. I counted 13 plus pages. I'm sure some of those places are on the outskirts. But still. It's a lot.
The same for Napa.

 

[Pauline]

Santa Fe is a big tourist destination (ranks in the top 10 in the US in many articles) and has a lot of hotels and B&Bs, plus vacation rentals. The town population is 70,000.

When we were looking at Santa Fe as a place to move to in 1988, we stayed in a vacation rental. There are several vacation rental agencies and some have been in business many years. I think the agencies probably list their places on AirBnb.

 

[Pauline]

I think the popularity of Airbnb is good for travelers. It gives us more choice and has made more travelers aware of these "slow travel" options. In the US many hotels are chains, stuck at the side of a freeway, and boring. How nice to be able to stay in something more personal.

It will be interesting to see how this all shakes out. I can see that hotel and B&B owners would be upset if they have to pay tourist taxes but Airbnb people get out of it. Perhaps it is time that places get rid of these tourist taxes. Businesses pay tax on their income. Airbnb owners have to report the income they make renting out their room/apartment/house and pay tax on it. Tourists bring money into a destination by spending on accommodation and food. Why must they also pay and extra tax per day on accommodation?

 

[Roz]

I'm no defender of Airbnb but have used them and been very happy. I'm not on social media either. I don't see what you mean about them collecting all kinds of info.

I believe the consensus in that Slow Trav discussion was that Airbnb did not originally require so much personal info. If you had rented from them in the past with no problems, you were "grandfathered" in to their system and did not have to supply the personal information. It was a year or two ago that they started those requirements for anyone who had not previously used the service.

 

[Roz]

Perhaps it is time that places get rid of these tourist taxes.

That will never happen because cities are unwilling to give up that source of revenue. After all, it's not like the tourists vote in the town. I think it's actually pretty good the way it's described as working in San Fran. Airbnb has agreed to register their rentals with the city and to pay the tax directly to the city, rather than having the owner add it on to their charge. I suppose the owner could show the amount of tax on the receipt, but it wouldn't add to the agreed-upon price.

That's sort of like the European system where the sales tax in stores is included in the sticker price, not added on at the end as in the US. I'm sure there must be many European tourists coming to the US who are surprised when they end up paying more at the register than the listed price.